Have their been exact dimensions released yet?

I'm most curious about the thickness.

It's official: Zune is going to bomb this holiday season.
Let's see rumors for the '07 model(s) please. Thanks.

a 3" 4:3 screen would actually have about 44% larger screen area than a 2.5". That's not "slightly" larger, that's a pretty big difference.

That's more than going from a 27" to a 32" TV set or a 17" up to a 20" monitor. And at postage-sized, i'm sure it's even more noticeable and less squinty.
not that i'm gonna buy infectious DRMware, but still. nice screen.

Songs only a buck, and FULL of crippling DRM. I don't know why anyone cares about this thing, its main purpose seems to be to allow MS even MORE control over how you use your computer and devices.

Oh, and to all the people raving about the design? It looks like an Ipod, circa 2001. It's just a rebranded Toshiba or something, right?

This is made of weak and fail. The subscription is $5/month more than Yahoo. The price is the same as an iPod not lower. I was completely ready to jump on the Zune train before this announcement. Now I could care less about it.

As an Xbox 360 owner and general MS enthusiast, I'm very disappointed.

so the zune has more features than the iPod for the same price, but is thicker. therefore you all think it sucks?

valid point.

by the way, the Creative players have more going than both the ipod and zune (except wifi) for less $. so by your reasoning, they must be selling more.

and THRIFTYTECHIE - what report are you reading that it has already officially failed? don't you have to wait a month or two after the product comes out.

with all that said, i'm waiting for the next ipod to come out and the next updated zune to make a choice.

the bigger screen and wifi are sweet but the thickness sucks. thats why I like the ipod. I just hope when they finally release that Ipod Video its just as thin or thinner then the current 30gb.

but overall the zune is sweet the ui alone is a reason to switch. (if you don't care about thickness.

mrhammerstein,
I'm pretty sure of Zune's failure because it doesn't offer much more than the entrenched choices (iPod, Creative Zen, SanDisk) and isn't much cheaper. It's not a great value.

One striking thing is how weak the "additional features" argument is in this G1 Zune; some of its features are liabilities:
1. larger screen
2. Wi-Fi
Both of these features require more power and hence make the Zune bulkier than competitors and have less battery life than its competitors
3. FM Tuner - OK feature, but useless in subways and redundant in cars.

Also, while Zune's Wi-Fi capabilities are intriguing, it's not (yet) a killer app because of the dearth of other Zune's to share with. This holiday season, Zune's Wi-Fi feature is infinitely useless. Ironically, this feature would be infinitely more useful in an iPod since there are 40 million of them out there to link-up with.

Don't get me wrong. I think with MS's backing, Zune is going to be a big-time player with...err...big time players in the PMP market. It's just not gonna happen Christmas '06 with this G1 Zune.

If the wifi could be used to say, check email / browse the web it might be ok. Not that the usability would be anything besides abysmal, but not bad. but the design... oh yuck. and making it look like an xbox 360, sorry I think that is one of the most overrated pieces of consumer electronics, design-wise.

The screen isn't that much larger than the iPod's. Also, remember it has the same resolution as the iPod's screen (larger pixels). Interested to see how the market responds to this, what with the Zune not working other with PlaysForSure content stores and all.

the songs are 79cents not a buck. 20 cents adds up.

The reason to buy into zune (though maybe not generation 1) is potential interoperability. The zune 'will' work with microsoft products and they're working towards mroe and more integration with their products like windows, Xbox/xboxlive, etc. Zune WILL be a part of the family and you can bet it'll offer some neat functionality. They're not gonna go full hog on the generation1 release.

The main question I have is about the zune marketplace subscription. I'm assuming it works like Rhapsody or Napster subs where you get to stream all the music you want and to burn it you have to pay for it.

Will this have a playsforsure'esque function to DL music to the zune based on your subscription without having to purchase individual songs?

Oh, and let me define "failure":
1. Zune will move less than 250,000 units Q4 '06
2. by January '07 G1 Zune's will be selling for $229 MSRP ($189 on eBay)

I am looking forward to the G2s and the Zune phone, though. Then things will become more interesting.

I wasn't going to point this out, but wallenc brought it up.

Zune's song pricing introduces us to an uneccesary currency exchange excercise.
Zune marketplace songs will sell for 79 units each.
One can purchase 80 units for 1 U.S. Dollar
Therefore each song will cost 98.75 cents.

Thus, if you buy 396 songs from Zune, you'll save enough money to buy one extra iTunes (or Zune) song.

Actually, the songs are 79 points... and that roughly equates to $1.

I think that the wifi-ability is a nice feature, but think that right off the bat it is going to more novelty than necessity for most people. And when the zune first releases you aren't necessarily going to have that many people out there with one.

i'll gladly pick one up for $189, thickness and all. it can go right next to my brick-size cellphone in my man-purse and i'll be on my way. brown of course. it's much more hip.

Well, color me stupid. When I read that I saw it as 79cents not 79 points. I stand corrected.

Anyway, about that streaming music without buying music thing.... ;)

And has anyone heard anything about zune marketplace being available via XboxLive and being able to manage your zune via Xbox? THAT would be great. Being able to put game trailers, music, movies, etc you got on XboxLive onto your zune would just make me all happy in the pants.

I hate using Microsoft products (who doesn't). So somehow Zune is going to not suck like everything else they do? And I have to pay the same amount for Zune as I would for an established, well-loved product (iPod). And I have to pay an arm and a leg for accessories? And it doesn't integrate with my car?

Why would I buy one?

Oh, wait, I'm sorry. I forgot... we get free crappy music and videos packaged with it. Now I'm sold.

Songs better be a buck. You'd have to buy them all over again when your PlaysForSure songs don't work on the Zune.

Oh wait, you can use FairUse4WM. Oh wait, Microsoft is suing the guy because he keeps breaking the DRM after it gets secretly upgraded (it was updated twice - first time after FU4WM came out (well-publicized), and again silently (version numbers kept identical) sometime later to break FU4WM 1.2/1.2fixed). So even if you needed to use FU4WM to get your already-purchased music onto the Zune, Microsoft keeps closing that door!

Wallenc,
The point about the 79 ponts isn't that you're colored stupid.
The point is that Microsoft is being stupid regarding their points system.

I have one simple question for Microsoft: Why are you charging 79 points for a song instead of 99 cents?

If anyone has a good reason, I'm open to hearing it.

so the zune has more features than the iPod for the same price, but is thicker. therefore you all think it sucks?

WiFi sharing of expiring songs? Meh.

FM radio? Meh squared.

The bigger screen is nice, but since my player usage is 93% music, 6% video and 1% photo, it's not must-buy-new-player nice.

I should have plenty of money for a zune the week of Nov 14... After I buy my PS3 and Wii.

Anyone need a kidney?

Wow Microsoft points, give it ten year you have Bill bills and Ballmer bills with which to buy your Microsoft child. Oh and that child does come with preprogrammed tricks and you can buy new ones for 79 Bill bills!

SOUP - wow. where to begin?

i don't hate using microsoft products. let's see, Microsoft Office might be the best software package. you have heard of excel and access and word haven't you?

the ipod is more refined and more well established. i agree. but you could buy a zune for a screen almost 50% bigger (i would argue and huge improvement over apple's incredible 60% brighter screen - wow, it's brighter (hope you caught the sarcasm)). the bigger screen seems to be what everyone is waiting for on the next ipod. now you have another option.

all accessories and right in the range of every apple accessory for ipods. so why buy an ipod to pay an arm and a leg to get apple's accessories? i'm sure cheap 3rd party accessories will follow. how many people bought $80 belkin fm transmitters?

and the point system is real lame. stupid MS.

I have one simple question for Microsoft: Why are you charging 79 points for a song instead of 99 cents?

I think wallenc proved why. People see 79 points and automagically convert it to cents, therefor thinking it's a super deal.

mrhammerstein says:

"by the way, the Creative players have more going than both the ipod and zune (except wifi) for less $. so by your reasoning, they must be selling more."

Exactly. I don't think that after the iPod, you can reasonably say this is just a hardware game anymore. This is about the integration of software/hardware/content into a coherent universe - which is precisely why Apple have been so successful.

Having said that, a new hermetically sealed universe a la iPod/iTunes is, I think, exactly what the industry doesn't need. Whatever happened to the idea of a unified format? For now, it's eMusic and ripping CDs until something better comes along.

I have another idea about the points.

Microsoft has been preaching a lot of hints about how their products interoperate and will more in the future. This is a huge topic for me if anyone hasn't noticed already.

The points are used on Xbox Live right now, that leads me to think a lot of their products are going to use this online currency and ultimately i think its a good idea for a global product. When you have flucuating currency values all over the globe, maintaining a constant 'steady price' on something is a pain in the butt. Having a static point systemn for all of your microtransaction products like XBLive and Zune type purchases (and most likely MMO purchases in the future, quote me on that later) gives you a single point to change when a price alters.

You change the cost of a MS Point and it dynamically changes the monetary value of all of your products that are purchased via that online currency.

As far as interoperability.. with the point system in place that just opens the door to put Zune and XboxLive marketplace together in some way shape or form... given the multimedia aspect of the Xbox360, having the ability to DL music and movies and TV to your Xbox and play it on your TV or port it over to your Zune would be a pretty welcome thing, also having it interoperate with a media center PC or other network devices. That interoperability is what will sell the Zune over the Ipod eventually and is why I'm jumping on it now.

I use bittorent to "obtain" my music. Will these songs be compatible with the Zune?

I think we all have it wrong. One thing i haven't seen anyone talk about is the sales people. Most americans(excluding the patrons of blogs like these) get their information from sales people. I know alot of sales people and they will sway the choice the most. And its going to take awhile, if it ever happens, to change their mind against ipods.

79 points -- the reason for this is that somewhere down the road, cost will vary (probably more expensive), but you won't notice since its still 79 points!

"I'm most curious about the thickness". Thats what she said!

I think an important thing to remember is that a huge market of people (see PC market share) know (or are at least familar) with M$ because of the O/S and Office. Most buyers in this market doesn't understand that iTunes will work with Windows. They associate it will Apple and that is foreign to them. They will be attracted to the Zune because it is made by M$ and by default is more familar to them.

Everypne missed the other point of this unit that ipod's dont offer TVOUT you can put video content on your zune and play it on any tv with rca connectors. Also being a microsoft os there will be apps you can load. This os is like windows pocket pc media edition. sorta like you have xpp pro and xp media edition. Another thing I don't own a 360 et but can't you earn points from playing games on your 360. Another one is you can freely share music between your 360 and your zune. Plus you aren't stuck with zune only songs you will be able to freely load all your music on this thing.

never posted er but i dont thionk my posts are showing

I wouldn't underestimate the value of the fm radio. Amidst all the griping, it should be pointed out that more people use the radio than Ipods. Combining both may be a plus you fail to recognize....

AE